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Monks and dyso

 
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2003 10:18 pm    Post subject: Monks and dyso Reply with quote

Greetings all,

Many of you know my character Aronthal, for those that don't permit me to say,

"Hello and well met."


So, I have been thinking about the availability of monk gear in Dyso and I have come to the conclusion that monks suffer from a lack of equipment in the game. So I opened up the toolset and tried my hand at making some balanced gear, not just balanced for monks, but balanced with the availability of other gear in Dyso. Also, I tried to select my color scheme so that aproxiamte "rank" of the monk is represented in the color highlights on their gear; the basic equipment color is black. How do I go about asking wether this equipment can be included in the game? Also if this is recieved well I might go on to make other equipment as well.

Here is what I have made so far:



Lesser - all black - for level 4 or higher

Initiate - black with grey highlights - for level 7 or higher

No name modifier - black with yellow highlights - for level 9 or higher

Adept - black with blue highlights - for level 10 or higher

Improved - black with green highlights - for level 13 or higher

Greater - black with red highlights - for level 15 or higher

Master - black with orange highlights - for level 17 or higher

Ancient - black with brown highlights - for level 20 or higher


Robes:

Lesser Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +2

Initiate Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +3

Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +3, Barkskin(12) 1 use/day

Adept Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +3, Stoneskin(7) 1 use/day

Improved Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +4, Stoneskin(7) 1 use/day, Saving Throw Bonus +1(universal)

Master Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +4, Stoneskin(7) 1 use/day, Spell Mantle(13) 1 use/day, Spell Reistance(10)

Ancient Robes Of The Lost Order: AC +4, Greater Stoneskin(11) 1 use/day, Greater Spell Mantle(17) 1 use/day, Spell Reistance(12)




Helms:

Lesser Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +2

Initiate Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +2, Wis +1

Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +3, Wis +1

Adept Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +2, Wis +2

Improved Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +3, Wis +2, Immunity Knockdown

Master Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +2, Wis +2, Immunity Knockdown, Immunity Mind Affecting Spells, Spell Resistance(10)

Ancient Mask Of The Lost Order: Decreased Skill Listen(-1), Decreased Skill Spot(-1), Ac +3, Wis +3, Immunity Knockdown, Immunity Mind Affecting Spells, Spell Resistance(10)
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ShadowCore
PostWed 03/26/03 10:56am
Yay. I like that. Stupid Dyso, doesn't support monks at all!!!  Reply with quote
 
Uin
PostWed 03/26/03 12:33pm
Pimp spell robes, bah.
Immunity helms, bah.
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Kindo
PostWed 03/26/03 1:37pm
Monks can use helms? icon_eek.gif  Reply with quote
 
ShadowCore
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ofcourse they can, why wouldn't they be able to use helms?
Now I'm going to comment on the robes and helms:
Hmm, I don't think the spell robes are to good of an idea, actually. They seem a bit...weird to me.
Actually, now that I'm actually looking at everything, EVERYTHING seems overpowered...

Nevermind, we need more monk items, but not like that, this isn't 2.x anymore.
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Z
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah Aronthal, as a monk myself, I agree with you about the under-support of monks compared to other classes, but as Shadowcore said I think that the items are actually a bit overpowered. I like the colour scheme tho :]
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well there is a reason why I selected the stats I did. Monks are a little limited in the gear they can get compared to everyone else. For example the only thing in the game that boosts strength that I know of are a couple sets of bracers. However monks need to use gloves to enhance their unarmed attacks. This is just one example.

The spell protections are in theme with the monks character type, who gain spell immunities as they advance in their careers. This will help a little with multi class monks as well, who are gimped if they can not reach level 16 monk. And rememeber the powerful robes are for higher levels and probably should not be found in stores, but rather have to be earned.

But I am certainly open to ideas on how to better balance them. Ohh and my original question stands, what do I do to see if they can be incoporated into dyso (in their present or in their modified form).
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kindo wrote:
Monks can use helms? icon_eek.gif


Yes but I thought there should be penalties for doing so. Originaly I had spot and listen at -5, but I thought that might be a little harsh.
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ShadowCore
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I suppose we should just wait for the new stuff to be implemented, because I am fairly sure that they said that new stuff will come.

Oh, and something I just noticed: I am now a deity icon_biggrin.gif
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hehe, Ok a couple of other justifications for the stats I chose.

1. A monks power comes from defense, not offense. All the stats I selected enhance the monks natural defenses. The spells on the robes can only be used once a day, and they are defensive in nature. Also I created all these items in the editor, so according to the editor they are within the item level restrictions ... so there!!! hehe

2. Due to biowares infiinite wisdom of not making monk gloves an actual weapon, a multiclass monk that does not reach at least level 16 will NEVER be able to get a +3 enchantment bonus on their unarmed strike. Gloves can only have attack bonuses, not enchantment bonuses. Granted the equipment I created does not address this problem, but it does allow a monk to equip kamas, at a reduced attack bonus, because they loose the glove effects while weapons are equipped, but in the meantime enhance their deffensive capabilities to compensate for their weakened offensive capabilities.

Now will someone please tell me how to submit these for use in dyso. I'd be happy to remove all the item stats if I could just get them in the game so I don't have to wear those stinking YELLOW robes anymore icon_lol.gif icon_eek.gif
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ShadowCore
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, we all hate the yellow robes, and we all love the black ones. But I'm telling new and COOL robes will be added in a while anyway, wait it out and relaz until then.

Oh, and a monk's power CAN rely on offense(that was my first monk), but that isn't as much the case as a defensive monk(the one I have now..).

But it's too powerful, really, all of the spell abilities and such, it's like we're back in 2.x. And I like being quite unique with my monkness, and when stuff like that gets implemented, you can bet I won't be as unique anymore. icon_biggrin.gif
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not to be argumentative, but how are you unique in your monkness? You probably are wearing the exact same equipment I am, you probably have a high dex and fairly decent wisdom, and unless you are also an elf no one could probably tell us apart except for our size differences. icon_lol.gif icon_eek.gif

Also please ignore the level 17 and level 20 robes and helmets, which would be very rare, and as I understand it even rarer for characters to reach the levels to even wear them. How are the lower level robes over powered? Is being able to cast stoneskin on yourself once per day over powered? Is being able to boost one of your core stats a little overpowered?

I'm not being belligerent. I'm actualy asking. icon_question.gif

I could have given soak or dammage resistance, but the belts in the game already provide that. I could have given bonus feats, but that would realy be powergaming. Bonus skills?? .. worthless. True seeing, freeedom of movement .. try adding them and get under a level 17 ILR.
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ShadowCore
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trust me, I'm unique...you'll notice when you see me and how I behave. Just look at my Order, I doubt anyone would'vce thought of a totally non-violent no-money thing. icon_biggrin.gif

Besides, I'm totally black and have blue hair.

And I just noticed something, you should at least remove the immunity to mind-effects and knockdown, we tried to get those immunities out of the game because they basically ruined it for several classes.

ANd my stats are probably a bit different as in no strength, and I'm human.
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ShadowCore wrote:
Trust me, I'm unique...you'll notice when you see me and how I behave. Just look at my Order, I doubt anyone would'vce thought of a totally non-violent no-money thing. icon_biggrin.gif

Besides, I'm totally black and have blue hair.


hehe, well I was hoping you would respond with something like that. I'm sorry for leading you into that little trap, perhaps I should be a rogue icon_wink.gif. So what you are telling me is that it is not your equipment that makes you unique, but rather in how you roleplay your character. In other words new equipment should not effect your uniqueness? heh

Quote:

And I just noticed something, you should at least remove the immunity to mind-effects and knockdown, we tried to get those immunities out of the game because they basically ruined it for several classes.


No argument there. I added them as a reward for making it past level 15, and doing whatever quest was nescessary to find them. But I am open to other suggestions. Even better yet, how about telling me who to send the equipment to, and they can feel free to edit them however they like before adding them to dyso. These at least could be a head start for em.

Quote:

ANd my stats are probably a bit different as in no strength, and I'm human.


Well my strength is only 11, but I am in fact an elf.
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ShadowCore
PostThu 03/27/03 5:42pm
Well, you got me there icon_wink.gif

Anyway, try PMing BriHurley.
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Falkhor
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2003 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New colorations on the monk robes, new gloves, new kama's, new helmets sound good? Sending stuff to Bri tommorrow or the day after. Need one last test to make sure they're ok. They look pretty snazzy though if i say so myself...
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Kindo
PostFri 03/28/03 2:35pm
As always, Falkie comes and saves the day. icon_biggrin.gif  Reply with quote
 
Malakalam
PostFri 03/28/03 4:43pm
I want my pants implemented!
pants!!!
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Aronthal
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2003 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Falkhor wrote:
New colorations on the monk robes, new gloves, new kama's, new helmets sound good? Sending stuff to Bri tommorrow or the day after. Need one last test to make sure they're ok. They look pretty snazzy though if i say so myself...

'
Good to hear falk, hopefully they can make it into the game soon. If you would like to see what I have already made, let me know where to send it. The robes and helms look realy nice, but are very simple, as a monks outfit should be.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2003 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pants are definitely a good idea. I want nothing more than to show off the tatoo emblazoned on my character's chest while walking around in the loose fitting lower-half of a gi. Now if only we could really grapple and throw.....
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Malakalam
PostFri 03/28/03 5:19pm
I also want to see vests, short sleeve clothing, shorts, and the other possible clothing combinations that nwn allows for.  Reply with quote
 
Falkhor
PostFri 03/28/03 6:14pm
all done. You're gona love my leather pants  Reply with quote
 
ShadowCore
PostFri 03/28/03 7:21pm
Yay!!!!!!!!
emot-heartbeat.gif
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2003 3:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

icon_biggrin.gif New monk gear icon_biggrin.gif

*hopes for an Obsidian Order robe* icon_eek.gif
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gloves of :vampiric regeneration, wounding, poisoning.

The gloves effects have to be small minor things because a 20th level monk gets 5 attacks, 6 with flurry of blows & 7 hasted & that is 1-20 damage.

Truthfully, how much help does a high level monk need? They have spell resistance & damage reduction as natural abilities. They are basically hasted already. You can't disarm them short of dismembering. Monks with high wisdom & dex have high ac. BTW, there are more items raising dex than there are to raise wisdom. Monks saving throws are the most balanced of all the classes. Their biggest weakness is to combat feats like knockdown.
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Malakalam
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually their biggest weakness is thier low BAB. it peaks at +15 I believe.

The toolset doesn't allow for a lot of things with gloves, since they aren't weapons. I think this includes on hit (wounding, poison, etc) and I don't think they get vampiric as well.
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ShadowCore
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How much help does a fighter need? Come on, that is just a bit weird, because a character may be good in unarmed/unarmored combat doesn't mean they don't need stuff. You're not telling me you don't want wizzies to have stuff either, are you? As long as stuff of that briliant quality for fighters and the like is staying in, I want more monk gear.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didnt understand anything of that post, n/m

I think there should be alot more monk gloves indeed! But I am afraid that thats qute hard... Robes would be cool though, make some robes that cover the body but not the arms, cause a monk is proud of his muscles and it looks cool! icon_mrgreen.gif

I got a cool robe here, +1 regen can I pm it to Bri? icon_mrgreen.gif icon_mrgreen.gif
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