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Brethren of the Tarnished Shield
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Spears
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PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2003 2:40 pm    Post subject: Brethren of the Tarnished Shield Reply with quote

(( I will update this post to include all the members who have been accepted ))

Tarnished Shield

Our primary goal would be to abolish evil in any way we deem necessary- force will always be our first option, unless we decide otherwise.

(( This differenciates from the OSB in many ways- the OSB usually talks things out, but we on the otherhand resort to fighting and such, which is really what most people want in a fullscale conflict ))

It will be a heirarchy- a ranking system if you will. Commanders will not make descisions alone, but instead rely on the feedback of our other members. (( It is very much based on the OSB ranking system, but with some differences- it will look something like this: ))

Captain(s):

William Spears
Girek Valume

Council:

Selven

Members:

(Pendling application)

Squires:

(Pending application)

This could use some revision, but its a rough sketch of the final painting as it were.

We will allow several alignment groups- mainly CG, CN, NG, TN. Our primary "hang-out" will likely be Eleriina // Kravenwood (so long as the militia doesn't boot us out.) We will also have a uniform- I tend to favor the 'red' color, so maybe the red dragon armour will fit well, but this is negotiable, and can be disregarded as well.

I look forward to your input and reply and/or interest to apply! (( Private message me if you really are keen on joining. ))

Warmest Regards,
William Spears


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Raven
PostSun 05/11/03 4:11pm
gh.  Reply with quote
 
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, great, return of the WHite Rose. Let's see how long it takes before this is corrupted icon_wink.gif

Edit: Why does everyone feel the need to start a guild all of a sudden? And can't you be more....original(ie. No more "we fight evil" bull. That's way too simple.....)
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ShadowCore wrote:
Oh, great, return of the WHite Rose. Let's see how long it takes before this is corrupted icon_wink.gif

Edit: Why does everyone feel the need to start a guild all of a sudden? And can't you be more....original(ie. No more "we fight evil" bull. That's way too simple.....)


Feel free to assume what you want, but for your information this will not be the WR all over again. Main reason for this is the number of members will be restricted.

As far as the we fight evil "bull" as you call it.....have you ever heard of the classic good vs. evil...the largest conflict known to mankind. Just wondering as almost everything is going to fit into that ideal in some way.

If you plan on flaming this please do so in the CRF forum. This is the guild forum, not the flame forum.
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OMG it's the WR all over again.

j/k

I hope this works out. It would be good to have a not-so-goody-2-shoes fighter's guild (not as in "Fighter" only, just one for people who like fightin').
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

As far as the we fight evil "bull" as you call it.....have you ever heard of the classic good vs. evil...the largest conflict known to mankind. Just wondering as almost everything is going to fit into that ideal in some way.


Hey, I realise that, haven't you looked at my own guild?

But please, I only want original stuff here, and you can say all you want, but this is absolutely not original. This stuff gets boring soon, and may even become an excuse to some members to randomly kill people.

In any case, good luck on making this a decent and slightly original guild, you have my respect if you manage that.........
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Give them a change, see how their guild turns out. Remember, ShadowCore, ppl were also talking bad about the HW when it first started, calling it "Dyso's First Country Club" if I remember correctly. But the HW also turned out to be a fine organiation.
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, that's why I just wished them luck, but I'm still a sceptic. At least about the originality part, ah well, we'll see icon_smile.gif
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We really don't aim for orginality- from my time in the OSB, I realized that evil gets away with too damn much, leaving most of us scratching our asses.

Really, the only way to deal with true evil is with force- I remember when I was fighting with Ogt everyone kept telling me that he was playing mind games and whatnot, and thus should be dealt with using his own strategy against him- that doesn't work, he enjoys the attention! If you kill evil and show that you're far superior than they are, they would watch where they step from then on.

I mean, if evil can kill anyone they want (and they do this everyday), at least give us good people a chance to get back at them without having to talk things out! You wouldn't allow a known murderer to run the lands freely- if you hear reports that he struck, they're probably right, why question him and give him a chance to run away?

The main thing about the BTS is that we don't care what people think, because in the long run we're doing the land a favor. The OSB deals with criminals using a code- but our code is to obliterate evil at all costs...

Fight fire with fire- if evil wants to play dirty, then god help me I will too.
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PostMon 05/12/03 8:56pm
Well, no one minds more protection. But if evil was really banished forever, then there would be conflict between the "good" guilds. It's inevitable.  Reply with quote
 
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2003 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My only OOC consideration in these matters is that folks who are members of more than one group keep their organizational information to themselves. This is one of those areas where some people firmly believe that a player should not or cannot be a member of more than one possibly conflicting organizations at a time due to conflicting possible ends.

I am not one of those people ... i.e. I believe that a good role player should be more than capable of playing one character for one group and one for another group and not mix their information. That said ... it doesn't take much for one or two people to ruin it by "bleeding" info that two of the player's characters would not normally (or even abnormally) share with each other.
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conrad Hollows wrote:
My only OOC consideration in these matters is that folks who are members of more than one group keep their organizational information to themselves. This is one of those areas where some people firmly believe that a player should not or cannot be a member of more than one possibly conflicting organizations at a time due to conflicting possible ends.

I am not one of those people ... i.e. I believe that a good role player should be more than capable of playing one character for one group and one for another group and not mix their information. That said ... it doesn't take much for one or two people to ruin it by "bleeding" info that two of the player's characters would not normally (or even abnormally) share with each other.


Very duly noted, and a great point. I'm sure I speak for both Palladium as well as myself when I say we will do our best to keep inter-guild information from affecting the way we RP both our characters and the characters of other members in the guild. icon_wink.gif I agree that it would be pretty piss-poor RP otherwise.
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PostTue 05/13/03 2:51am
the only thing i have to say on this new guild is william please contact me ic and conrad will understand what i mean when i say "xs?" again?.......  Reply with quote
 
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is not xS again- conflicts between the xS internally caused its downfall. We hope to form a tightly knit brothehood which react to certain things thrown in our path. We don't intend to mold the server to our liking, but vice versa- because thats what life in the real world is. This is what the xS achieved- a union of players. We aren't a union- we are a group of people who RP the legendary battles of good vs evil, without having to discuss politics- its boring, time consuming, and pointless. Remember that xS did not embrace war as thier primary option.

My reasoning for actually starting the Brethren of the Tarnished Shield:

Its like Darkovn- he RPs very well.. the only thing is, he will NEVER allow you to take advantage of him. For example, he says he captures my soul in a ring that doesn't exist... fine by me. Then when I try and do the same, he says his soul is uncapturable, or something of the sort. Evil people think they're so invincible that its annoying! Someone has to step forward and take a swing- we have to knock them back into place. We are a leash of sorts- if they get out of line, we tug. We aren't patient lawful people... we hit something if we don't like it.
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So this is, instead of a Lawful Good organization, definitely a Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good or maybe even any of the Neutrals (except for Neutral Evil).

I mean, smiting someone who is evil just because they're evil isn't necessarily a Good act. You're toeing the line, therefore, you're (something) Neutral.
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hows this- our intentions are good (because we are good at heart) but we do not use lawful methods to get these intentions accomplished. That would make it chaotic good wouldn't it? icon_razz.gif
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

palladium - no offense, but darkovn was right.. his soul is elsewhere... hehe

anyway, try to ignore all the people attacking your guild idea, it sounds fine to me, just define it a little stronger and open a new post, ask that people only post whether or not they want to join, and they can discuss it in this thread.
Its about time we had an agressive good group, (as compared to passive like OSB).
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Hows this- our intentions are good (because we are good at heart) but we do not use lawful methods to get these intentions accomplished. That would make it chaotic good wouldn't it?

Actually, it doesn't. Killing people outright just because they're evil is NEVER a good act. It is ALWAYS an evil or neutral act, since killing people is evil.

It's simple really, you can't say "We do it with good intentions.", because a lot of evil men think they are doing stuff for the good of everyone, but their means are wrong. Don't look at the ends when defining alignment, look at the means.....
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I may be off base on this (correct me if I am Palladium), but I believe we will react to those caught in the act of doing evil.....ie someone killing someone, rp trash talking (for lack of a better phrase) someone else (of course in this case I doubt our reaction would be to kill them), etc. I hadn't planned on just killing someone who is evil for two reasons 1) my character doesn't know they are evil unless heard through the grapevine in-game or in the ic forum, so it would be poor roleplay to react and 2) I don't believe my character would have a problem with the existence of evil in the land (as there are a bunch of trolls, skellies, etc.), but rather the evil actions those that are evil take.

Make sense? Looking at my post it looks confusing to me, but hopefully the point came through somehow. icon_lol.gif
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly to Shadowcore. And yes, you guys could certainly have Lawful Neutral people in your group, as a matter of fact they would make the best leaders - or maybe True Neutral - because they would be the ones who would keep everyone in line, and kick out those who acted up too much.

If you're going to have a rule which is "kill anything evil", then that makes you at least a little Lawful, because it's a rule you follow no matter what, but it does NOT make you Good (necessarily), because you most certainly can have an evil reason for wanting to kill evil things. However, if you take more of a stand like the Order of the Howling Wolf, which is no set rules at all - in other words, take each situation as you find it and deal with it in your own way - then you're Chaotic. But you see, we believe that mercy should usually be granted, and things observed and possibly talked out instead of killing - therefore we lean towards Good.

Remember, when determining alignment, it's generally: "Ethical Moral".

I'm glad you guys are giving something like this a go because far too often what the OSB does/did smacked of Lawful Neutral, not Lawful Good like they're all supposed to be.
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pssst ... the OSB doesn't have a set alignment on LG ... it is actually made up of members who are LG, LN and NG. The end result of that is that it is often seen as more LN than LG and that's what happens when you operate within the tenets of the law where even the "evil" are believed to have rights.
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2003 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

only one point enjoy yourself fighting the battle against reason ..but except for dear Darkovyn and a few more there is little Evil for you to fight here.Unless things change this guild will at best be a Darkovyn fan club for there are few other reasons for its existance.The thieves aint evil as such there just making a living the only way they kno
I mean the lets look we have the OSB the Druids these Shield Guys the Elerina White Gaurds and on and on and on....what evil guilds are there ??? few and far between.Why most players seem to think they get more advantages by claiming to be good and supporting these worthy causes though usually there actions and behaviour say otherwise.Seriously Palladium if you want to improve RP and fun on the server go over to the dark side make a Group of Dark warriors Mercenaries ...Fallen Paladins seeking refuge in this new land.We dont really need another snivelling Goody look at me Im wonderfull WR clone though this time well be good .We have enuf of that already seriusly look ....the more balance G/E the more tension the more strife the more polarisation of players .And thus more intrest and hopefully enjoyment.Palladium forsake your corrupt gods embrace the dark side.
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PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Druids may LOOK good or bad but we kill the bad AND good guys to keep the balance. We are indiffrent. We attempt to make peace and keep a balance between all forces. Without Evil there would be no Good and vise versa.
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PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah! Thank You, Conrad....I forgot that the OSB was not just a bunch of true-blue Paladins.

So it sounds like, how the OHW is a little of the OSB and the Druids mixed, the BTS will be somewhere between the OHW and the OSB.

Good thing we've got the Scamps to balance things out! icon_wink.gif
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PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Palladium wrote:
This is not xS again- conflicts between the xS internally caused its downfall. We hope to form a tightly knit brothehood which react to certain things thrown in our path. We don't intend to mold the server to our liking, but vice versa- because thats what life in the real world is. This is what the xS achieved- a union of players. We aren't a union- we are a group of people who RP the legendary battles of good vs evil, without having to discuss politics- its boring, time consuming, and pointless. Remember that xS did not embrace war as thier primary option.


Ok time for me to speak up here.

xS failed for several reasons. One of them was because it WAS a player guild. The internal conflict was IC not OOC. That is why I suggested to all of the rest of you to not to mix alignments in your guilds. Good and Evil together does not make Neutral. It makes turmoil.

The other reason it failed was because certain members took it upon themselves to constantly start wars on other players or characters that ticked the victims off IC and OOC.

"Talking boring politics" by myself and Corsan is all that kept xS from ruining the fun for the whole server and keeping it in roleplay. We spent entire days where we did nothing but roleplay with the OSB and other political factions in the world to try and IC resolve issues. All I can say about that is that the roleplay was good and it was just that. Roleplay which is what the server is about.

The other problem was the amount of hassles that were generated due to the constant "war" which ended up being player conflicts in the end as people got ticked off and it ended up getting to be adminstrative in nature.

"conflicts between the xS internally caused its downfall. " This is not a completely acurate statement. The players chose to disban the guild because of the administrative issues generated by the conflicts that were being roleplayed out. The guild just didn't work in character at all harmonously with the rest of the server. All of the players are still friends and have traveled on to other servers together and we had a great time roleplaying all of it.

Here is my advice. Take a hard look at what you are trying to do.

Here is what I see from reading this thread. I see a free roaming band of fighters, OOC friends, running around not roleplaying cause it's boring and killing any evil character on the server that they choose. I see this generating administrative issues and more strife on the server whether or not that is the intention.

Constructive thoughts? Dyso is out of balance. There are too many good players. Instead of hunting the few remaining evil characters and having all of them leave, create an evil guild.

I think this concept would be great for roleplaying evil characters. You could be a band of mercenaries for hire. You could plot to take over areas, capture towns, hold seiges. If the brotherhood is strong enough you would have a good base for creating cool events and could roleplay with the OSB as an opposing force.

Just my spin.

Angel
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PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

_MJ_ wrote:
the only thing i have to say on this new guild is william please contact me ic and conrad will understand what i mean when i say "xs?" again?.......


count me in also, Where Corsan goes I follow. If you dont want me as a member, count me as an allie and or friend to your cause.
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PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Talia_k wrote:
_MJ_ wrote:
the only thing i have to say on this new guild is william please contact me ic and conrad will understand what i mean when i say "xs?" again?.......


count me in also, Where Corsan goes I follow. If you dont want me as a member, count me as an allie and or friend to your cause.


Uh I think you misunderstood his post. He was saying that he thought it was a bad idea too....
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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2003 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

After much discussion with my colleague, we have decided to change the guild to evil (because of the suggestions we have receieved).

Forum mods, feel free to lock/delete this topic, as I will be starting a new post with our new charter. Thanks icon_smile.gif
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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2003 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

icon_eek.gif

Sweet! A truly Evil Guild!

Will you take Lawful Evil people???
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PostThu 05/15/03 11:23am
MK, way back I tried to start a Black Knights guild, LE/NE. No-one joined, but maybe I could resurrect it, you or anyone else wanna help?  Reply with quote
 
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