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via chipsets and radeon 9600's....dammit dammit dammit

 
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Aedin
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PostPosted: Sun May 18, 2003 10:13 pm    Post subject: via chipsets and radeon 9600's....dammit dammit dammit Reply with quote

this sucks.. got a new raddy 9600 pro the other day.. install it, fire up dyso and bang.. lockup. reboot try again.. and again.. lockup.. so i do me a little checking.. turns out that 9600's (or any ot he 9x00 above 9500) dont particularily like my motherboards kt266 chipset.. so now its saving up for a nforce2 board... grrr...no dyso until i can afford a new board.. this sucks.. because b4r i locked up i was getting a min of 30-40 fps.. when before it was 15-25 fps with my graphics settings to medium-high.. playable but choppy at times... now they where soooooo smooth!! ... argh!
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Malakalam
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

*writes down another reason to tell people to stick with nvida*

why don't you use your old board until you get another new one or a new motherboard?
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Hurin
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol, I work with Aedin IRL and I can say he's stuck with what he's got for now. ATI does make good quality cards, it's just NWN was built around the Nvidia Chipsets. I've played with both the top Nvidia and ATI video cards, and right now ATI does have the best card.....for now. icon_wink.gif
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Hurin Rothich
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Ng'ree
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 2:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They no longer have the best card,
GEForce FX 5900 is better http://www6.tomshardware.com/graphic/20030512/index.html
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Aedin
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

actually the 5900 is barley beating the 9800pro and the image quality on the 5900 is terrible in comparison. if you check the [H] (http://www.hardocp.com) thier review is an impartial review of both cards. the 5900 does score marginally better, but the image quality does come into play. the 5900's anti-aliasing cannot compare to the quality of ati's, and once again.. when the eye-candy (fsaa, AF) is on, ati pulls ahead. also - tom's hardware is biased towards NVIDIA and INTEL... and have been ever since those company's have been slipping tom some $$ ... i refuse to belive ANY review toms puts out.. wether or not ati comes out on top.. TOM's is bunk. there is a know issue in Neverwinter that allows them to have higher framerates, but when the Detonator driver suite (from the 42.xx dets up) has been banned from the futuremark Online Result browser due to 'driver cheating' - aka sacrificing IQ for speed - i wouldn't want an Nvidia card anyway... why pay top dollar for a card that has to cut corners to keep up to the speed of thier competitors, but at a penalty of image quality... i ran at 20fps and NwN looked amazing... i wont run at 40fps if it looks like crap.
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not_so_unique
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why not take the ATI card back and exchange for an Nvidia, like the Ti4600 or something? That is what I run and I have no hassles. Also, why you want to hook up a KickA GPU with a (somewhat) "outdated" chipset? It seems like overkill. Just a thought from a hardware hobbyist.
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Hurin
PostMon 05/19/03 2:38am
Hehe tomato.gif  Reply with quote
 
Aedin
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

right now my vid card (was a 9000pro) was my main bottleneck in my system to decent performance. we got in these 9600's at a good price so i snagged one. as it stands my rig is the fastest of the people i work with, and they're all avid gamers as well. Hurin is going to be getting his new system soon, and also going with the 9600... and its like i said.. i wont run nvidia.. unless i can get a 4600 for free.. thier IQ sucks. plain and simple.... i've always ran ATI cards since my i upgraded old voodoo3 3000 and i've loved them. i've also been in contact with ATI trying to get this worked out without replacing my mobo
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Hurin
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 2:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My wife is running the MX 440, crappy little card, but good enough for NWN. I was considering the TI4200 due to the overclocking potential with the MSI made version. I had one of those little cards pumped up to 4600 specs easily....errrr...I mean Aedin did(he's the overclocker).
But at the same time, I can spend almost the same amount of money on a faster card....the 9600pro, and overclock way beyonf the TI4600specs.

It's all in what a person really wants, personally, I love the TV out capabilities of ATI, that is one thing Nvidia cant touch.
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Hurin Rothich
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Falkhor
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 7:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

My wife is running the MX 440, crappy little card


Most wives these days are sold with better hardware these days, must be one of those outdated models...
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Nefiorim
PostMon 05/19/03 9:39am
Hehehe lol..
Anyhow.. Radeon 8500 here, never any problems.
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dreamin'
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tehe, if you want to talk about image quality and the Geforce FX 5900, look at www.beyond3d.com
Using techniques like that I can make my old Geforce2 look fast icon_mrgreen.gif

Oh, and I just noticed that I use a KT266 mobo myself, with a 9700pro in PC1 and a 9600 in PC2... So it shouldn't be the via chipset that has trouble with the radeon, but rather the specific mobo (mine are epox boards). I guess you tried contacting your mobo manufacturer? Maybe there's a bios update?
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Aedin
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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2003 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i've updated everything.. bios's (1014 beta) looks like unreal tourne 2k3 is working beautifully though, as well as half-life.. so i'm thinking its an issue with neverwinter itself.... time to try to contact bioware....
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Conrad Hollows
PostMon 05/19/03 10:53pm
I dunno, I've been using my ol' Radeon for NWN and it's given me no issues whatsoever ... especially once I upgraded to the most recent drivers.  Reply with quote
 
_MJ_
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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2003 12:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey, i like my gforce4 thank you very much, it does just fine in anything i get into especially with the new drivers. keep checking back with makers for more i got 2 new ones since i got the card.
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Aedin
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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2003 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

conrad.. i agree.. my 9000pro worked fine.. albiet a little slow, but the new one crashes.. i'm going to try fiddling with the hardware accel features ,as i heard that theres a glitch in opengl and the new raddy's with full acceleration turned on.. move it one step back ont he slider and it'll work properly i've been told so i'm goona try that once the doomIII alpha is finished d/l (i wanna tourture my card... hehehe)
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dreamin'
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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2003 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the hardware acceleration in windows has nothing to do with the opengl driver...
It's only the gui acceleration features that you can manipulate with that slider.
Oh, and if you speak to Bioware's tech support, or post on the official forums, and a bioware employee tells you sth about "ati is not opengl compliant", just ignore it and ask for another opinion. If Dave McGruther answers you, ignore it in every case, cause he not only has no clue about radeon, but about their own game.
weirdlook.gif
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Mogster
PostTue 05/20/03 8:22am
You may have tried this already, but I have to ask anyway: are you using the latest VIA 4-in-1 drivers?  Reply with quote
 
Hurin
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2003 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, Aedin did get his Radeon 9600 going...I got to see the Doom 3 Alpha test on his system....smooth. Neverwinter was working until about an hour later when his hard drive died on him. Boy is he one sad individual right now, lol. He's just waiting for the replacement hardrive to come in from Western Digital.
But, the good thing is that the Radeon 9600's do work with neverwinter, just have to put that slider back one notch. And accually, I believe the slider was in the display properties Dreamin, because it does have a direct association with the gameplay.
Well, that did decide it for me, I'm getting the 9600 this week icon_biggrin.gif . Ahhh... finnaly, I don't have to share my wifes computer anymore icon_wink.gif
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Hurin Rothich
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Hurin
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2003 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mogster wrote:
You may have tried this already, but I have to ask anyway: are you using the latest VIA 4-in-1 drivers?

Yeah, he's always got the latest drivers, he always gets them the same day they came out....He's pretty anal about that(hehe icon_razz.gif ).
That is a good point, as I found out the hard way. Without the latest Hyperion driver, Neverwinter does not play. I tried it with older, outdated 4in1 drivers and it was like trying to play NWN on a P3 450....crappy and laggy. The new driver fixes that. Via's funny that way.
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Hurin Rothich
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Kindo
PostThu 05/22/03 9:45am
I am impressed by how you guys totally manages to avoid speaking English.  Reply with quote
 
Little Teapot
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2003 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kindo wrote:
I am impressed by how you guys totally manages to avoid speaking English.


Grammar, kindo, we need grammar...

or not.. that sentence is fairly funny without it... (though kinda (kindo- HAH) cliche)
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Matthijs says:
   oh ja, ik weet het zonet nog niet
Matthijs says:
   het ziet er toch wel een beetje naar uit dat we nederlands praten
Matthijs says:
   mischien moet ik dan maar eens vaker nederlands gaan praten
Matthijs says:
   kan je me ook meteen niet op al mijn spellinsfouten wijzen
There you have it! indisputable proof Solo's a fascist!!!
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Jon316
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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2003 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i never understand computer nerds, i just like to watch them, if i want to actually learn something i go to the manufacturor or the creator of the product in question, and yeah my spelling sucks... icon_confused.gif
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Aedin
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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2003 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

alrighty ladies and germs! to once and for all put the nail in the nvidia vs. ati debate!!! fromt he www.hardocp.com website, and furturemark:

--

3DMark Patch:
Futuremark has released a patch for 3DMark 2003 that eliminates "artificially high scores" for people using NVIDIA Detonator FX drivers. This is in response to the news item we posted last week ( as did several sites ). According to the PDF on Futuremark's site, the patch causes a 24.1% drop in score for NVIDIA and a 1.9% drop in score for ATi meaning that Futuremark is claiming that NVIDIA isn't alone in this whole ordeal, other companies have "irregularities" as well. It is good to see Futuremark fix the current situation to remove any unfair advantages, but this goes to show you what we meant in our "Benchmarking Right" article. Thanks to everyone who sent this one in.


Recently, there have been questions and some confusion regarding 3DMark®03 results obtained with certain NVIDIA drivers. We have now established that NVIDIA’s Detonator FX drivers contain certain detection mechanisms that cause an artificially high score when using 3DMark®03. We have just published a patch 330 for 3DMark03 that defeats the detection mechanisms in the drivers and provides correct results.

----

the fx no longer reigns!!! proof that nvida HAS TO CHEAT to keep up to ati!!! hahah!! and if you read it even states that ati does take a score hit as well - but only 1.9% in comparison to nvidias' amazing 24%!!!!!!

oh and hurin.. when i get my system running again i am soooo goona tank ur arse for the 'anal' comment!!!!
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